Loaded: The Hahn Ready Mix Podcast
A podcast for the employees of Hahn Ready Mix
Loaded: The Hahn Ready Mix Podcast
82. Rockin' out with Riverstone's Bob Gronewold
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Andrea and Griff are joined by Bob Gronewold from Riverstone as we talk about the aggregate mining and dredging processes, what goes into quality control on our aggregates and how our companies work together.
Also: Red's is open and a couple more spots to wash trucks in Davenport!
Welcome to Loaded, the Hawton Radio Mix podcast with Andrea Meyer and Griffin Hahn.
SPEAKER_03Howdy, how are you?
SPEAKER_00We're on our own.
SPEAKER_03We're well, we're not on our own.
SPEAKER_00We're without Lex's supervision.
SPEAKER_03Lex has abandoned us.
SPEAKER_00Um he's doing real work today.
SPEAKER_03He's got other priorities, apparently. Whatever those, but we upgraded today. Uh so we have Bob Gronwold with Riverstone here. Welcome. Thanks for having me, guys. Appreciate it. Yeah. Looking forward to it. Well, I can I he I told him to stop shaking because he's so nervous.
SPEAKER_00He's not much of a conversationalist. This will be really tough for him.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, talking and things like that are tough. So I know you're a longtime listener. Uh I am a longtime listener. It's good to have you on here finally. So we've been talking about it for like a year. Um it's good to good to finally do it. Great. What do we have for announcements to get started?
SPEAKER_00Um you mentioned this before that we were going to put in additional uh washing stations, and that is up in up in action now. So it's good news for everyone.
SPEAKER_03It is.
SPEAKER_00My husband and I drove through this weekend to bring some stuff to the dumpster, and he was like, Well, would you guys get that? Well, we have it right inside the building. He's like, Think I could wash my truck here. And I'm like, No, that's not good. That's not for you.
SPEAKER_03Tell him to use uh the hammer claim on his truck. That's good. Yeah. And then we have an another first for the podcast today. We have our first guest announcement. So, Bob, what do you have as an announcement for I have good news?
SPEAKER_01Our uh Eldridge Recycle Yard, uh often uh referred to as Reds, um, there. And we're accepting broken concrete and uh ready mix watch out, wash out again. So I know that's been wonderful news.
SPEAKER_03Yes, wonderful news. Dispatch is gonna be dancing a jig and permanently reopened, right?
SPEAKER_00No potential future closing. Where this is a permanent announcement.
SPEAKER_01We're gonna try to stay ahead of it, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Trap you into that on the record.
SPEAKER_03Yes. Awesome. I think most of our office people know you, but many of our drivers may not. And so why don't you just give us a quick background on yourself and who you are, where you're from, what the heck are you doing here?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. So um grew up here, uh northern part of Scott County, been here pretty much my entire life outside of college. Um, came back after college, got into sales, uh working for a different company. And about 10 years ago, I started with uh Riverstone and area sales manager for them. So that's kind of the work side of things outside of work.
SPEAKER_03I guess it's some nepotism about getting that job.
SPEAKER_01I'm just curious. Uh there was a uh father-in-law who uh bothered me for years to come and uh come and work uh work for Riverstone. So eventually I was I got a little serious and took a serious look at it. Okay. I'm not judging. I got my job coming out. So that's big from you. Yes. But outside of work, I got I got two kids, uh a son who's a junior in high school and a daughter who's eighth grade. Um follow them with all the sports and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_00I've seen you at softball tournaments or something, but we never are head-to-head yet, I don't think.
SPEAKER_01Yes, she actually stepped away from softball last year and ended up uh she's really into volleyball, so we've uh gone into the full volleyball world.
SPEAKER_00Maybe we'll see. Is she playing school volleyball? School volleyball too. Maybe we'll see you this year then.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yep. So whole world I had no idea about, and wow, wow, wow, wow. So but nope, that's that's uh the skinny on me here. And it's I've always just been in the area, always uh went to North Scott High School out there, and it's something that um just like being part of the Quad Cities is a good place to live and good place to uh raise a family.
SPEAKER_03So absolutely. Okay, give us the lowdown on Riverstone. I most of our folks will know the name Riverstone and know that uh we buy the majority of our aggregates from you guys. But um, yeah, give us uh just a quick snapshot of of the company and what do you guys do?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so um Riverstone's a mining company based here out of the Quad Cities, Davenport, Iowa is the main office. And basically we produce crushed stone products, uh also sand and gravel. It's something where the simplest way to think about it on the crushed stone side is uh we take big rocks in a quarry and crush them into small rocks that uh work for a variety of different applications for our customers. And then on the sand and gravel side, we're dredging sand out of um sand deposits and uh producing uh a finished product that works in concrete, asphalt, and things like that. So mining and sand and gravel is basically.
SPEAKER_03You guys have a huge footprint, right? I mean, so like you go from is LaSalle, Peru your furthest east area?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03And then down through St.
SPEAKER_01Louis and Yeah, exactly. So uh the area that I'm responsible for is the Quad Cities out to LaSalle Peru, and then down by um Macomb, Illinois. And then our sister company picks up down in Hannibal, uh, Missouri, and we have uh locations south of St. Louis as well. So that's Central Stone, but uh same owner, same same company in that sense.
SPEAKER_03So yeah, it's a big uh big operation you guys have got.
SPEAKER_01Yes.
SPEAKER_03How many locations do you have total?
SPEAKER_01Over 50. Over 50. Wow. Some of them are recycle yards, and but I mean adding all those up between the quarries and sand and gravel pits and recycle yards.
SPEAKER_03So yeah, yeah, awesome. So um, you know, I think it's worth saying uh a family-owned business, which I feel like is kind of a rarity in the the size that you guys are to have a family-owned business, right? That um is is still not sold out, right? So uh that is that's wonderful. I mean we appreciate that part of our relationship that we can have, you know, two family business working together. So talk to me a little bit about you said you sell to a lot of different customers that use a lot use your materials for a lot of different things, right? So what's it like? Like what's the the difference for selling to a ready mixed company with with the concrete stone specs and the concrete sand specs we have versus I don't know, rip wrap or or base stone or anything else you guys sell? Like how how does that work?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I would say the the the sales process is similar. I mean, you're calling on customers, building relationships, and um, you got to know your product, of course, and everything like that. But I would say the main difference when it comes to selling it is the importance of quality and gradation um when it comes to selling to ready mix. For example, Illinois DOT and typically Department of Transportation, when they're looking at aggregates, um the Ready Mix uh PCC side of things is the the top quality requirement. You know, for instance, in Illinois, it's got to be a quality where on the asphalt side of things, it's B it's B quality on the rock side of things. CO coat C quality, base stone is D quality. And so there's different requirements there, but uh kind of the way we kind of feel like asphalt's more like D quality. I'm a concrete guy as well. So we do have an asphalt division, but I I'm definitely a concrete guy at heart. So yeah, I mean that's one of the biggest things is just the quality difference, the importance of the aggregates going into the mix, and you know, it's for many anything from of course sidewalks and flat work to you know big bridges. Um we obviously work together a lot on the 74 bridge and yeah, a lot of major projects.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I I bet a lot of people don't realize how much goes into like monitoring gradations and specific gravities and all these different metrics that we have on our aggregates. And whenever we, you know, need to make a change or see something, you know, we have to talk with you guys about like how what what's going on. Are we into a different deposit or we have is there production changes and all that, right? So that's it's um there's a there's a lot going on there. It's not as simple as pull rock out of the ground and put it in a truck to sell, right? So yeah. Well, I think you talked on it a little bit, but um, let's go into a little more detail. So like the mining process versus the dredging process. Like how do how do those actually work? Because I it's really, especially the mining part, is really fascinating to go see. Um I've been lucky enough to be able to do that. But yeah, walk us through how that works.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So I'll start with the dredging process, which is your sand and gravel. Typically, you're looking at a sand deposit that's located uh many times along uh the river here in the Quad Cities, it's the Mississippi River primarily. And um you're going in and you've got a strip if there's uh dirt or anything off the top in the beginning, but then you have a dredge that's actually sitting in a pond of water that's going through and it's sucking through pumps, it's it's sucking the sand out of the deposit. And so um there's typically a cutter head that's on that. So if it runs any type of deleterious material, the clays or anything like that, it can get through that and then it gets pumped up to a plant, it gets screened. Typically, we're screening off the gravel in a sand gravel deposit and then um separating that uh the sand so that we can make a asphalt sand or ready-mixed sand. Goes through a classifier, which classifier helps with the gradation and pulling water out. And then here in the Quad Cities, it either goes on a barge um on our river-based operation, or it runs to a stacker to be stackpiled up at our Cordova sand operation. So that's the dredge side. So the um the quarry side of things, of course, you have to have the property and you had to have it stripped, and that there's a whole process on the front end of that. But then when it comes to actually producing, you're drilling um into a face on the quarry, uh, a wall in the quarry, and um, there's a bunch of detail that can even get into that. But whether you're trying to produce a riprap, the bigger rock, or you want to produce a smaller rock. But with that, you drill it, you blast it. Let's talk about the dynamite. That's what people want to do. It is pretty cool to see a shot. So um typically, you know, you're shooting tens of tens of thousands of tons at one time, and it ends up in a shot rock. And so from that shot rock size, it's got to be crushed down to a more to a size that can be handled better. How big is the shot rock size? Like, I mean I'm sure it's variable, but you can get huge boulders that I mean are you know uh five feet wide or you know, five feet tall kind of deal. I mean, typically that shot, we're trying to condense it to get it as small as possible. But I mean, probably a couple, couple feet and like. Yeah, so really big. Yeah. Yep. From the shot rock, it typically gets loaded with a wheel loader put into a primary crusher. And that primary crusher, especially with the river stone, we're we're a bit unique. We have a lot of uh conveyors in our operation.
SPEAKER_03Um and they're all blue. They are, yes, riverstone blue. I sometimes I see like a conveyor like being trucked somewhere. And I'm like, oh, that's riverstone's because it's blue.
SPEAKER_01There is a river stone blue. Yes, you're right. So it gets crushed, it goes through the primary and it gets crushed into like a six-inch down or an eight inch down. So when I'm saying down, it's all the way down to dust, basically. So you got a six-inch or an eight-inch top size, and that helps when it's on the conveyor belt to be able to be transported effectively. So you don't have big rocks falling off and everything like that. So then it typically gets conveyed up to a secondary plant where it then gets sized down even more, and maybe um like a three to one inch size rock will get pulled off, and then we'll run it also through like we have major log washers that take the rock and paddles inside that like rub the rock against each other to get deleterious material or any type of things that we wouldn't want to be in that. And so it gets washed and then screened into, depending on what we're making that day, a lot of times, a CM11 for you guys or a GR3 Iowa spec. Yeah. Um, so yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, we didn't you you I meant to say this earlier in it, but like when you're making sand or stone, you uh like us straddle the river. And so you have to make stuff that meets Iowa and Illinois DOT. Um, so as much as we have to have different mix designs for those, you have different specifications for gradations and quality requirements and all that um that you have to balance and make sure you have enough of each of those products.
SPEAKER_01Yes. And sometimes they're similar and then other times they're completely different on what what each state wants.
SPEAKER_03So definitely How much are you guys like having to adjust to the geology of what you're pulling out? Like I I I assume it's maybe more on the sand because you're not crushing it, but like if uh how much do the deposits change as you move around the dredge or or even I was thinking the same question because you said you go explaining that whatever you're trying to make, and I feel like when we've had some exposure to this in the past, it was like you're gonna make whatever's handed to you.
SPEAKER_00How does that work?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, um so I mean the geology geology can definitely change. Typically, the Iowa DOT and Illinois DOT here locally, we've had it broke down by either ledge or bed, um, where they say, hey, these ledges need to stay together, and this makes this quality type of material. And then maybe the next, maybe that needs to stay together. And it could be the same quality. There might just be a variance in maybe specific gravity or something like that that can, you know, make them want to keep those certain ledges or beds together. And it's something you have to stay ahead of because in general, it's the we're making a lot of the same products over and over again because we're typically making to Iowa DOT spec between all the the Iowa and Illinois DOT, but even on some of the commercial jobs, a lot of the engineers are specing DOT materials. So a lot of the material ends up being kind of driven by whatever the state has put out there for requirements on their jobs, too.
SPEAKER_03So you said specific gravity, and that's a term that we've used on here uh a number of times uh on the podcast. But in case anybody doesn't know, I'll let you do the definition. What's it what's specific gravity mean?
SPEAKER_01Aaron Powell The simplest way is just to think of it as the weight of the rock. I mean, yeah, in layman's terms, that's what it is, I'm sure. So you like the scientific version, I'm sure.
SPEAKER_03Well, it's just checking the time on the podcast. 100 pounds of rock is 100 pounds of rock, but if a rock with a heavier, like a higher specific gravity, that rock will take up less volume at 100 pounds, right? So it's uh it's actually a multiple of how dense water is, right? Or how heavy water is, right? So if uh a lot of times we're sitting, you know, 2.65 to 2.7 or so with the rock, right? So that's it's uh the rock is 2.7 times heavier than water at the same volume. That's not our term for the day, by the way, Andrea. Just in the flow of conversation. Uh great. What about let's talk about washing. Why is it so critical to wash uh the aggregates you guys are are are mining?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I would say one of the biggest things, whether it's crushed stone or it's a sand and gravel pit, I mean, it's a natural deposit. So it's naturally there. Um it's something that can have variation in it. It can have what I would what I've said deleterious, but that's basically, you know, you're looking at like your shales, your clays, if there's coal or lignite, those types of things that typically aren't, you know, aren't desirable to be in the thing you don't want.
SPEAKER_03Right. I I once uh we had a deleterious material introduced after uh we bought it from you into our rock pile and it got thrown at me at a job site, it was a dead rabbit. Um so that would be a deleterious material.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. But I mean, that's it, you're it's um very, very good quality rock and deposits here locally here in the quad cities. It's some of the best in the state of Illinois. And but it's something that even with that, you have to always be washing it. And so we have these huge wash wash systems at our plants to get all that off so that when it gets to you, it's something that's very, you know, usable and workable and you're ready to mix concrete.
SPEAKER_03So yeah, and it's it's important for us because obviously we're binding these materials together in concrete, right? And so if they are slimy and dusty, right, uh then you can't get a it's it's kind of coated, it's got like a protection that stops the rock from binding with the the cement paste. So we don't want that. We want the rock to bind. Um so that's what yeah, that's why it's super important to have it wash. So uh we appreciate that that is part of your guys' process. Yeah. What about um stockpiling, right? So you guys manage, like you have specific things you do to manage your stockpiles. You know, moisture content is always something that's a big deal. Um obviously your customers we want to buy the rock or the sand and not uh and less water, right? So but but you have washed it, right? So it's all gonna be wet. Right. So like what do you guys do to manage that process?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So on I would say on the crush stone side of things, um, there's uh, you know, a program on the way that we we have these big stackers typically at the locations that you guys haul from, and they help to um prevent segregation in the pile, and they help to stockpile the material in uh in a uniform way. And then that allows us, there's a certain way that we have our loader operators load out of a pile so that you get a consistent product. So it's kind of every step of the way you're got your eye on quality control and making sure that you're know there's a process to it all, there's a why behind everything that you're doing there. Um on especially Illinois DOT side, uh every day we're typically, or at least multiple times a week, we're taking stockpile samples depending on the volume that's going out to see, okay, is this running consistent with whether what our production is, you know, and then um so we're testing, we're testing the gradation on the front end while we're producing it, and then as it's being loaded out of the pile to make sure that it's staying consistent and there's an, you know, nothing, nothing going on there.
SPEAKER_03So and that gradation is so important for us for consistency in our mix design. We are trying to pack all these materials in together, and so if they're all the same size, they don't pack as well. So that can impact uh the workability of the concrete and how much cement paste needs to coat the aggregates and and the ultimate strength that we get, water demand. Um so yeah, so that's that's always a huge deal. And and we have to verify the, you know, on our end too, that once we get it at our plants, we have to take those gradations and um verify that they're they're in the range to the DOT ones, right? So uh yeah, that's that's a big deal. So you kind of anticipated my next question about, you know, what kind of testing do you guys do? So anything beyond I know you have to send like materials off to like Springfield, for example, for Illinois DOT for for a barrage of tests, right? So what what what are those what goes into those?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So each state has its own requirements and its own testing. Um, like you said, Springfield for Illinois DOT and Ames for Um Iowa DOT. So they have people locally who are responsible for the materials and keeping an eye on state-approved materials and everything like that. So the testing that's involved, they test for um what they call soundness, uh freeze thaw, which is part of the soundness side of things, abrasion, um, ASR is important in US's world. But so they're testing for, you know, does this do these products hold up for what they're intended to be used for? You know, as if if it's going into a bridge, if it's going into a roadway. Are they gonna be durable? Right, exactly. The durability, are they gonna last or there's are there problems? And so those are tested on a certain frequency. Uh a lot of times it's it's uh based on how many tons you're producing. So we have some pretty good sized plants where we're producing on um some pretty big tonnages per day. So uh especially Iowa DOT as a testing frequency that's a little bit more than Illinois DOT, but yeah, it's uh it's continuous. It's every month on the Iowa DOT side, and Illinois DOT side is multiple times a year. So yeah, you'll have to well.
SPEAKER_03I tell you, we were just talking last week on the podcast about kind of our whole company sales philosophy. And one of those key tenants is using quality materials and having quality products that we make. Um, and so you guys are such a key part of that equation for us because we know we can trust the material that you guys are making. Um and and if things do get out of whack, then you know that's when we have a conversation and it gets fixed right away. And and um and that's what makes our relationship so strong, I think. So uh I appreciate that. But it's it's our vendors like you are so important to that success on on making that whole strategy work for us. So I appreciate that a lot.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, we appreciate the business and we appreciate the relationship. Like you said, I think anytime something comes up, we try to get to the bottom of it and um try to figure out what's what's going on or what the different variables can be that could be impacting what you're seeing.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, no, it's But when Griffin calls you, like when you see his name come up on your phone, do you like take a deep breath and clear your schedule for the rest of the afternoon? Or like how how do you really feel when he calls?
SPEAKER_01It's just a major groan now.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. That's why I go to voicemail first and he calls me back like once he's been able to Okay.
SPEAKER_00I have a snack and a drink. I'm ready.
SPEAKER_03Well, I mean, a lot of times what you and I talk about more is uh like upcoming work, you know, and making sure we're aware of projects and things like that, vice versa. So um yeah, that's that's the majority of our conversation.
SPEAKER_01So it seems to lean that way. Yeah. Yep.
SPEAKER_03Yep. But cool. Um anything else that you want our people to know or think it would be useful for them to know um while you have the the pulpit here to to preach?
SPEAKER_01No, I mean I think it's something I know you guys have uh some of your own drivers that come to our quarries and um you know are haul are hauling rock and stuff like that. And it's something where if you don't know, ask the question, stop by the scale house. I mean, it's the scale house attendants and stuff are willing to help. If it's something, if you're new and you just don't know where to go. I mean, yeah, um, we can help in all that. It it's get you to the right pile and try to get you on your way. I know we uh we implemented uh license plate readers a couple years ago uh at a lot of our locations. And so we've got a check-in and check-out process and stuff. And I don't know, maybe that's something we'll dive into in a future podcast or something like that. Perfect. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, so everyone knows Griffin has like 30 more questions he wanted to ask, and I'm I'm cutting them off. So it's could be a series.
SPEAKER_03I was managing the content as we go through.
SPEAKER_00Good job. But yes, we will we will need to have Bob back.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, we will, for sure. Uh we're gonna do a term for the day.
SPEAKER_00Yes, please do.
SPEAKER_03Okay, do you have one for me or do you want me to go ahead? I can't wait. I did I picked one that was uh related to aggregates. So uh and this is a new thing, Bob. If you didn't know, we're doing a uh term of the week for uh concrete term.
SPEAKER_00So allowing Griffin to do just a small amount of education and her least favorite thing.
SPEAKER_03And so she's she's permitting it on the podcast. Uh so our term this week is saturated surface dry uh or SSD. And SSD is a is not real. It's a figment of our imagination. It's a theoretical thing. It doesn't actually exist, but it is the state that we assume our rock or sand to be in when we design mixes. Um so what it what it means is every mind aggregate will have some level of um porosity holes in it, right, that can absorb water. And when we use rock and sand in a concrete mix, we're assuming that those pores, or they will be, full of water when they're in a mix. So we we're assuming this theoretical state where all the pores on this piece of aggregate are full of water, but the entire surface is dry. Um, and so a lot of times when we have to do testing, you have to try to get your sample of aggregate to an SSD situation. And it's literally done by soaking it and then putting it on a towel and rubbing the rock with a towel until it looks like it's dry on the surface, and then doing your test right then before it evaporates out of the pores, right? Um it does not exist. It's not a thing that can be done, or at least not for more than a millisecond. But that is the basic uh kind of state you assume on a mixed design. And a lot of the tests are based on having to get to that state. So if you ever hear somebody say, well, the rocks at SSD, not really, but it could be close. Um we try to keep our stockpiles. We want it to be a little bit wet because we don't want them to be in absorption, which is when they're pulling away.
SPEAKER_00That's another term for another day.
unknownJeez. Okay.
SPEAKER_03But we need to be at SSD or above with our with our aggregates um in our mix or in in production. Uh we want them to be a little damp.
SPEAKER_00I like I like it. I like how you connected to the content of the podcast. I will say this is going to be much more challenging to use the term in your everyday conversations. Although we haven't I haven't had anyone approach me using the word from last week, you know.
SPEAKER_02But nobody's said it's early. It only came out yesterday.
SPEAKER_00So there's still there's still a chance for somebody to win a prize by using the word of the week. But uh thank you. Well you said so many other words that need to be in future episodes during that explanation.
SPEAKER_03Great. We're gonna we're here for it.
SPEAKER_00Okay. Come back next week. I will try to help him pick an easier word.
SPEAKER_03Wonderful. Well, Bob, thanks for coming on. This was a lot of fun and uh appreciate you coming in to chat with us. Yeah, thank you.
SPEAKER_00All right, great partner. We like seeing you.
SPEAKER_01Like seeing you guys too. No.
SPEAKER_00Thanks for listening to Loaded the Hon ReadyMix podcast. We'll talk to you again next week.
SPEAKER_03Adios,
People on this episode
Podcasts we love
Check out these other fine podcasts recommended by us, not an algorithm.
